Transcript
>> HINOJOSA: He travels around
the world, from Antarctica to
Tanzania, from Alaska to
Australia, to assess the impact
of global warming and to promote
conservation.
Environmentalist and lead
scientist for the Nature
Conservancy M. Sanjayan.
I'm Maria Hinijosa.
This is One on One.
Sanjayan, you are the lead
scientist for the Nature
Conservancy.
You are born in Sri Lanka,
raised in Sierra Leone, you
spend a lot of your time
traveling around the world
actually looking at the impact
of global warming.
>> SANJAYAN: Right.
>> HINOJOSA: So when you hear
people say, in this country,
"Well, I don't really feel it,
it doesn't feel like a crisis,"
you say what?
>> SANJAYAN: So the way I approach global
warming is that I think of it as
an insurance question.
It's like if you were driving
down the street and someone told
you that your house was on fire,
and then someone said, "Oh, no,
it's not really your house, it's
the house next door, don't worry
about it," what would you do?
You'd probably turn around and
go back.
You have insurance not because
you actually think your place is
going to burn.
You have insurance because, you
know, if it happens, it's such a
catastrophic problem that
there's no real way out of it.
So right now we're in this
really important point where I
feel like if there is a
possiblity that this is going to
happen it makes a lot of sense
for us to take care of it now.
And I think it's not just a
possibility.
Most scientists would agree that
it is a reality.
The debate mostly is about how
quickly it's going to happen and
what we can do about it.
>> HINOJOSA: But the fact is
that you still encounter, as a
scientist, a lot of people who
say that humans are actually the
ones who are causing all of the
problems.
>> SANJAYAN: I do encounter them, although
you'd be surprised at the fact
that I don't encounter a lot of
them.
Most people...
>> HINOJOSA: Where do you
encounter them the most?
Are they in this country, are
they in other parts of the
world?
>> SANJAYAN: It's not outside the US.
Outside the US, you know, I
was... not very ago I was in the
forest in Indonesia.
And to get there it's, you know,
three plane rides and then, you
know, ten hours in an...
>> HINOJOSA: You and your plane
rides.
>> SANJAYAN: ...SUV, exactly.
That's true, good point.
Fair enough.
>> HINOJOSA: You and your plane
rides.
>> SANJAYAN: We're not perfect.
None of us are perfect, right?
So... but, you know, you get in
there, and then there's a local
chief who's telling you that he
has seen the climate change in
his lifetime.
So I'm hearing it.
You know, I've seen it in the
Arctic, where local people are
telling me that.
For me, climate has moved out of
just the realm of science now to
personal narratives of people
who will tell you what's
happening around their space.
Once you meet those folks, the
doubts are erased.
Sort of the scientific,
dispassionate sort of thing that
I could take is gone away.
>> HINOJOSA: So the most
surprising thing, kind of the
most shocking thing that you've
seen, where it's just like, "Oh,
my god, I knew it was bad,
but..."
>> SANJAYAN: Okay, so my most shocking
story on this is that I went up
to the Arctic, and I...
>> HINOJOSA: This was for the
show on Alaska.
>> SANJAYAN: Yeah, this was for a show on
Alaska called Expedition Alaska.
It's about climate in Alaska.
But we met this guy, and I spent
a lot of time with him.
His name is Archie.
And Archie is a legendary whale
hunter.
You know, they go out in kayaks
and hand-throw whales...
harpoons into big whales.
He's 70-plus years old, and he's
of the highest status rank in
this Nupiak eskimo village.
Very, very high status kind of
guy.
And one day he was with me in
one of his cabins, and he said,
"I want to show you something."
This never made it on the show,
actually.
You know, I followed him and he
took me into an ice cellar.
And an ice cellar is something
that the eskimos cut out of the
permafrost, which is frozen
earth, in order to store their
meat.
And it's very, very hard to
build.
You've got to chip it out of
solid ground, right?
Solid frozen ground.
And inside, it's stacked with
all the meat for his family, and
his extended family.
So whale, and walrus, and goose,
and caribou and so on and so
forth.
And he said, "This has been in
my family all my life."
And this guy is 70-plus years
old.
>> HINOJOSA: Oh, you mean, like,
they build it once and it stays?
>> SANJAYAN: Exactly.
It's like the Frigidaire, the
permanet Frigidaire made out of
ice.
>> SANJAYAN: Exactly.
And... because it's hard to
build these things, and it
goes... you know, generation
after generation will use the
same cellar.
And he said, "You know what?
Last year for the first time in
my memory it thawed out, and I
lost, you know, a third of my
meat for the winter," which is a
big deal for those guys.
>> HINOJOSA: Of course.
>> SANJAYAN: And he said, "Guess what's
happening now?"
And he took me to the corner,
and this was sort of in
September, and sure enough
there's a puddle of water
dripping from the wall.
And so we emerge out of this,
and I was shaken by it.
And I said, "What are you going
to do?"
And he pointed out, and outside
his house he's got a GE
refrigerator/freezer sitting
there, waiting to be plugged in.
>> HINOJOSA: Oh, my god!
>> SANJAYAN: And I thought, "Yeah, you
know, this old thing about we're
going to sell," you know,
"freezers to the Eskimos is
really coming true."
So once you meet a guy like that
who's showing you something
that's happening in his life,
and he's an old guy, so he knows
the patterns of nature, it's
hard to be dispassionate about
it.
You know that you are part of
the problem, and thus you also
have to be part of the solution.
>> HINOJOSA: But of course,
people are going to say, "Well,
god, that's dramatic, and it's
happening in Alaska."
>> SANJAYAN: Yeah.
>> HINOJOSA: And so...
>> SANJAYAN: What about here?
>> HINOJOSA: And so what am I
supposed to do?
You know, they can write checks,
and we'll go through a number of
things.
But what does that person do?
>> SANJAYAN: Get informed by it.
>> HINOJOSA: But, you know,
there's almost a part... I'm
sorry to interrupt you, but
there's almost a part of people
who say, "You know what?
We have too much information.
All the time we're hearing about
the climate crisis."
And it's almost as if people are
saying, "It just feels like it's
talked about all the time," and
so then therefore the crisis
nature of it... so when you say
"Get informed," it's like, "Get
informed how?"
Like, in what way are we
supposed to be getting informed
that's going to be different?
>> HINOJOSA: You know, I think
you have to personalize it.
You have to make it real to your
life.
And I think one of the first
things you can do is find out
how much carbon you actually
use.
So you can do a carbon audit.
It's not that hard to do.
Lots of Web sites do it.
Our own Web site, you know, at
nature.org, which is the Nature
Conservancy's Web site, will
help you do it.
It's a quick thing you can do,
it takes five minutes, and it'll
give you a sense of how much
carbon you're using.
And it might surprise you where
you're going to emit the most
amount of carbon, what part of
your lifestyle.
It might not be your driving.
It might be your house.
It might be, you know, the kind
of food you eat.
And you can make small changes.
This is what I believe.
I think we can knock our carbon
emissions down by 20% right now,
you and I, without changing
anything major about our
lifestyle.
And you wouldn't notice the
difference.
>> HINOJOSA: So, for example?
>> SANJAYAN: For example, you know,
driving patterns, food you buy,
how much you heat every room in
your house, leaving things
plugged in when you're not using
it.
You know, I just left for a big
trip, and when I left my house I
didn't just, you know, turn
things off.
I actually unplugged them.
Not your refrigerator kind of
thing, but my television and
VCRs and DVD players and things
like that.
>> HINOJOSA: Your computers?
>> SANJAYAN: My computers, exactly.
Because just even having them
plugged in keeps them on
standby, which means they're,
you know, energy vampires, and
they're draining a little bit of
energy all the time.
That's a really simple thing.
Eating just a little bit of less
meat every day or every week can
make a difference.
It's healthier for you, but meat
tends to be very heavy in terms
of how much carbon goes in to
produce...
>> HINOJOSA: That's what my
husband the vegetarian... he's
like, "You know what?
You want to talk about being
green?
>> SANJAYAN: Good karma.
>> HINOJOSA: Stop eating meat."
And actually, I did.
I stopped eating red meat,
because... you know, just
because I was tired of it.
But...
>> SANJAYAN: You'd be surprised.
Just go and look.
Do the carbon calculator
yourself, and I bet you just
that change probably has knocked
you down by 20%, just that one
change.
>> HINOJOSA: Okay.
>> SANJAYAN: And I'm not even telling
people not to eat meat.
I'm just saying eat just a
little bit less.
It's probably healthy for you,
because most Western diets are
hugely, you know, tilted in the
wrong direction in terms of red
meat.
>> HINOJOSA: But we may be
eating less meat, but does that
mean that the industry itself is
therefore...
>> SANJAYAN: It...
>> HINOJOSA: ...contracting, and
then that's what's having the
impact, right?
>> SANJAYAN: Right.
So there is a chain.
I mean, obviously, yes.
Absolutely.
So if you buy less stuff, or,
you know, fly less, or, you
know, heat your house less, or
eat less meat, it is going to
have a downstream impact.
But I actually think that over
the long run it actually helps
everyone.
You know, I was in Arizona a
year or so ago, a couple years
ago, and I watched in a ranching
community in Douglas, Arizona,
which is not exactly the...
>> HINOJOSA: It's on the border.
>> SANJAYAN: On the border, and it's not
exactly a place where
conservation is the first word
out of people's mouths.
>> HINOJOSA: Right.
>> SANJAYAN: I watched a room of 50
cowboys... you know, this is
with hats and cattle dogs
sitting right next to them in
cowhide jackets, complete dead
silence in this room while a
scientist was telling them about
what was happening to their
range land because of climate
change.
And the scientist was basically
saying, "Did you guys know that
last year was the first year you
didn't have frost on your land?"
And every head in the room
nodded.
And he said, "You know that it
means it's going to be a really
bad fire season this year."
Every head nodded.
Those guys were frightened.
They really were frightened.
So, you know, they're losing
their livelihood for a host of
reasons, and I don't think that
adjusting our diet by ten, 20
percent is ultimately going to
make, you know, most ranchers
just immediately go out of
business.
That isn't what I'm trying to
push here.
>> HINOJOSA: So how many people
actually, Sanjayan, have to go
to nature.org and take the test
to figure out... I mean, in
order for it to have a real
impact.
How do you measure these things?
>> SANJAYAN: That's a really tricky
question that you just asked,
how you measure the impact of
the work you do.
I actually think every person
should do it-- every single
person on the planet.
Every single person certainly in
the US who has an access to a
Web site should be able to do
this and find out what their
impact is and make small
adjustments as they see fit.
And then make bigger adjustments
in terms of, you know, what you
learn about, what kind of
legislation you push for or ask
for.
That's what informed citizenry
is.
And think of it as an insurance
policy.
Here's the deal-- if we are
completely wrong on this, we've
lost some money and we've lost
some economic steam.
But if we are right and climate
change is happening as the most
august body of scientists, like
the National Academy of
Scientists, is telling us, we
don't have another planet to
have a do-over again.
And that's where it becomes
really serious.
You know, you don't really have
another chance at this.
So you... you know, the cost of
dealing with it today is about
the equivalent of one latte a
week from Starbucks.
If you wait 50 years from now...
>> HINOJOSA: For everybody in
the United States, or for
everyone...
>> SANJAYAN: Yeah, every person in the
Western world.
And it just gives you a sense of
how much.
It isn't a huge amount of money.
It's significant, but it's not
huge.
You wait 20 years, you wait 30
years, the cost rises
dramatically-- by an order of
magnitude.
So deal with the problem now
when you can still actually deal
with it, or deal with it later.
Either way it's going to happen.
>> HINOJOSA: But still, it feels
like for so many people, like...
and so when someone who's
quite... someone makes a
statement that's considered
quite controversial... we were
talking about this.
This is from Bangladesh.
And one of the top
environmentalists of Bangladesh,
which is the country that's on
the front lines of kind of
receiving all of the impact of
global warming-- floods, you
know...
>> SANJAYAN: Sure.
>> HINOJOSA: And he says, "Well,
you know, what's going to have
to happen is that the United
States... I have a calculation,
a mathmatical calculation, that
the amount of land we lose
because of global warming, the
United States and China and
India that are producing the
carbon emissions that are
causing this, you're going to
have to take this number of
Bangladeshis, because they are
environmental refugees."
And then people are suddenly
like, "Wait a second.
No, no, no, no, no."
Then it almost feels like, "Wow,
so we're going to have to
actually see people who are
environmental refugees?"
Then it begins to feel a little
bit more real.
Or...
>> SANJAYAN: Absolutely right.
So there's entire nations... and
Bangladesh is really on the
forefront, you're right.
But places like the Maldives,
which will just completely
disappear... and those people
have to go somewhere.
And they're generally going to
go to Western countries.
So there's going to be a huge
change in patterns of how people
move.
But to be honest, you don't have
to go that far.
You know, Miami is right in the
path of this.
A lot of coastal Florida, a lot
of Boston, a lot of the eastern
seaboard, is really going to see
the impact of rising sea levels.
And those people are going to
have to move back from there.
And as people move back, then
there's impact further and
further away.
So for me, you know, I look at
climate change as being... you
know, it's a unique problem.
We're the only... you know, it's
the only environmental problem
where every single person is
contributing to it.
And because every single person
is contributing to it-- you,
me, and everyone else-- you
can't just point to the bad guy.
You can't say, "It's the loggers
over there," or, "It's these
people over there."
We're all doing it.
And so the only way to get a
handle on it is for us all to
then take collective action.
It's really a unique problem.
>> HINOJOSA: So when you think
about communities that are in
this country victims of a kind
of environmental racism, for
example, and you think about the
fact that these are poor,
predominantly of-color
comunities that are being dumped
on, and all kinds of reasons...
for all kinds of reasons, what
do you say about the fact that,
in the world in which you move,
Nature Conservancy, these very
high-powered kind of... not
elite, but important
conservation and nature
institutions in our country, do
these people...
>> SANJAYAN: Yeah.
>> HINOJOSA: ...from these
communities, predominantly of
color, poor Americans, do they
have a voice?
>> SANJAYAN: Yeah, great question.
So the environmental movement,
for the most part, the Western
environmental movement I would
say, over the last 50 years, has
not done as good a job as it
ought to in dealing with the
poorest of the poor and the
people who are going to be most
impacted by, you know, global
changes, and have the least
ability to do something about
it.
I think that is definitely
changing today, and I think that
the reason it's changing is
because I think that both these
sides are understanding that
they're just two sides of the
same coin.
You know, when conservationists
have looked at people, they've
often seen people as the
problem.
We want to create a national
park to keep people out.
>> HINOJOSA: Right.
>> SANJAYAN: You know, we want to do this
because people are the problem.
I know what that thinking is all
about, but people are also the
solution.
And it's not about... you're not
protecting something from
people, you're protecting it for
people.
We've spent so much time
thinking about where we want to
do conservation we haven't
thought about why we want to
actually do it.
>> HINOJOSA: So is that a
conversation, essentially, that
within your own institution,
Nature Conservancy...
>> SANJAYAN: Absolutely.
It is a thriving conversation
within our own organization, and
frankly within all big
conservation organizations right
now.
Like, when you go... especially
when you go outside the United
States, where real poverty and
hard poverty is hitting you.
And do you just ignore the
people and just focus on nature?
And, you know, I make no
apology, and my own background
really forces me, you know, and
inspires me to live in a place
where there's big animals that
can take my head off.
I like that.
>> HINOJOSA: You mean in
Missoula.
>> SANJAYAN: In Montana.
>> HINOJOSA: In Missoula,
Montana.
>> SANJAYAN: I love that about it, right?
But not everyone is so
stimulated by that.
And for poor people living on
the margins of nature, you know,
they have real livelihoods and
real needs.
Now, here's the good news-- what
we find out is that for poor
people, nature is frankly even
more important than it is for
the rich and well off.
>> HINOJOSA: Because?
>> SANJAYAN: Because if the river dries
out, they don't have an
alternate source for getting
water.
If the forest does not have
trees anymore, they do not have
an alternate source for heating
their homes.
You know, there are 149 million
people in the Pacific Rim who
feed on fish.
That is their primary source of
protein.
If the fish go off from the
reef, if there's a massive
dieoff of coral, bleaching
happens, and they lose their
potency to have... you know, to
produce fish, those people will
starve.
So what I have found is when
I've traveled into rural areas,
they're not calling it
conservation.
They don't use that word.
But nature is incredibly
important to the poor and
downtrodden, because they have
no chance of replacing.
They can't go to the store and
buy a bottle of water.
>> HINOJOSA: But I'm thinking
about the piece that you did
when you... a very personal
piece that you did.
Was it also for Discovery?
This was when you went to Sierra
Leone.
>> SANJAYAN: I did that for the BBC and
then Animal Planet, yeah.
>> HINOJOSA: And then Animal
Planet.
>> SANJAYAN: Yeah.
>> HINOJOSA: And you were born
in Sri Lanka, your parents both
worked for the United Nations,
you're living in this little
village...
>> SANJAYAN: In West Africa.
>> HINOJOSA: In West Africa,
Sierra Leone.
>> SANJAYAN: Yeah.
>> HINOJOSA: Love it that when
you were going to school with
the kids in Sierra Leone they
all looked at you and called you
the white guy.
>> SANJAYAN: Yeah, sure.
>> HINOJOSA: But you go back to
see the impact that war has had
on nature in Sierra Leone, and
there's a moment where you have
this conversation where you're
with one of your friends, who
has all the chimpanzees.
>> SANJAYAN: Oh, yes, yes.
>> HINOJOSA: Who's protecting
the chimpanzees.
All of these orphan chimpanzees,
which was also kind of
extraordinary.
And you have this conversation
like, "There's a lot of poor
people who live right outside of
here, and we're talking about
protecting the animals."
>> SANJAYAN: Yeah.
Right, that was a great moment,
you know?
And he's an old friend of mine.
And his whole... his philosophy
was there was a lot of
organizations that were thinking
about human needs, why not have
one organization thinking about
animal needs.
I come at it from a little bit
different perspective.
You know, when people say to me,
"Look, how can I think about the
forest or the tigers in India
when there's, you know, millions
of people who are starving?"
I say that's true, but the
tradeoff is not real.
It's a false tradeoff.
It's a false dichodomy that
people are setting up for you.
If you said to me, "Poverty in
India would disappear, but we'd
have to get rid of the tigers,"
it might be a tradeoff that I
might be willing to consider,
and a lot of people would be
willing to consider it.
The truth of the matter is, if
the last 2,000 tigers that are
left in India today disappear,
all you'd be left behind is poor
people in India and no tigers.
I've never, ever seen a
situation where poverty has
disappeared or gone away through
the loss of an environmental
service.
I haven't seen it.
So people set that up and say,
"Well, if not for that national
park, we'd all be rich."
No, it doesn't really happen.
If not for the national park,
you'll still be poor, and you
won't even have that option to
exercise it in the future.
>> HINOJOSA: So does that mean
that as a conservationist,
you... one of your focuses is
actually alleviating poverty?
>> SANJAYAN: Right.
So it's a slippery slope there,
right?
>> HINOJOSA: Because some people
might say, "Wait a second, as a
conservationist..."
>> SANJAYAN: "I just gave you money for
conservation.
What are you doing doing work
that, you know, CARE or Oxfam or
some other organization should
do?"
We have to keep our ball... our
eyes on the mission.
And the mission is to protect
nature.
But how we do it and why we do
it can definitely change.
So my whole philosophy has been,
unless local people are willing
to take a stake in that nature
and say, "This is important to
our livelihoods, it's a real
issue for us, it ranks in the
top five issues along with
health care and kids and
security and so on and so
forth," it won't ever be
sustainable.
And the minute the money dries
out-- and the money will always
dry out, the money coming from
the US or from Western World to
protect these places-- it'll be
an open... you know, it'll be
open season again.
So for me, it's all about trying
to convince local people,
showing them the link and making
it explicit that if they manage
their nature, their natural
resources well, it will actually
benefit them over the long run.
Now, there are some cases where
you're down to the last.
Look, you've got, you know, 300
mountain gorillas, you've got to
go in there and protect it, go
in there and protect it.
And there are some cases where
you just have to give food aid,
because there are refugees on
the move, and you can't talk
about, you know, nature and all
that.
You just have to give them food
or medicine or whatever.
But in a lot of cases, in maybe
the majority of the cases, that
link can be made and
strengthened.
>> HINOJOSA: But what about when
you hear... when you see what's
happened with the poor, which
is, "You know what?
I do have to take down that
tree, because I need to build
the fire, because I need to...
and I'm going to keep on cutting
down the trees as fast as I
possibly can."
And then people are saying,
"Well, you see?
That's the problem, is that
you've got too many people, and
people are using up the
resources."
And if they're poor and they're
desperate, they're going to do
what they have to do.
>> SANJAYAN: Right, so that's called the
tragedy of the commons, which is
that if there's a resource out
there, and it's a collective
resource, there's an
accelerating chain where each
individual is trying to maximize
their gain, and it keeps
happening.
Interestingly enough, a woman
recently by the name of Elinor
Ostrum won the Nobel Prize for
work that essentially says not
always, under circumstances,
under certain conditions, people
can manage a resource for the
common good over a long period
of time.
The trick is, how do we
strengthen those levers that
allow them to do that?
It isn't always the case that
people will go down this
accelerating path.
If there's urgent need, you have
to meet those urgent needs.
But once you get out of that
absolute survival stage, you can
think forward.
Look, you know, I've gone on a
few trips to Indonesia recently,
because I think it's a
fascinating and complicated
country, even though my
experience is mostly in Africa.
And I'll tell you something-- I
was with a guy by the name of
Mohammad, and he works for the
Nature Conservancy.
And he was telling me how he
goes to these villages, and
instead of talking to them about
marine protective areas-- you
know, "Set aside this area for
fish"-- which he got nowhere
with, he now talks about fish
banks, banking for fish.
He says, "Look, this is really a
savings account for you guys."
And all of a sudden the
villagers are turned on.
They want to now collectively
establish marine protected areas
where fish are safe and breed,
they can grow to big sizes and
thus breed, and then the
spillover is then harvested by
communities.
But just turning the words
around and calling it a fish
bank and giving people that
connection has made the world of
difference to him.
>> HINOJOSA: So as we wrap up,
Sanjayan, what do you want
people to talk away from this?
You know, you said get informed.
>> SANJAYAN: Sure.
Well, first of all, don't get
depressed, right?
It's still a fun world out
there.
You know, we have this thing
that said, "Look, at least try
to outlive, you know, those
guys."
So go out there and enjoy the
natural world.
It's still a fascinating and
amazing place.
But definitely get informed.
Don't be sitting... don't sit
this one out.
Don't sit this one out.
You don't get a do-over.
We are really the luckiest
generation on the planet.
You know, we... 50 years ago we
didn't know what was going to
happen.
50 years from now, it really
would be too late.
But we're in this narrow band--
why wouldn't you want to be born
right now?-- where we can see
the future and actually have
time to do something about it.
>> HINOJOSA: All right, but give
us the list.
Give us... just because I want
to leave our audience with a few
concrete things.
>> SANJAYAN: Sure.
>> HINOJOSA: Get informed.
>> SANJAYAN: Join a conservation
organization, whether it's the
Nature Conservancy or a local
organization in your backyard,
that's fine.
Because that'll get you informed
in your local community.
>> HINOJOSA: Okay.
>> SANJAYAN: Let your kids lead you.
Kids right now in school are a
little bit ahead of the parents,
and they will tell you... you
know, my niece is going around
telling me when to turn off the
lights, and she's sort of
reverse engineering my family,
who has been not as fast at
adopting these things as I maybe
would have liked myself.
So that's great.
So let them lead, you know?
Let them lead.
Have fun doing it, and give.
Give.
You know, right now the
environmental movement is so
down the list of people's
worries.
Move it up the list.
It is as important as health
care, security, and education.
>> HINOJOSA: And can I ask you,
Sanjayan, what do you do in your
own life?
I mean, how do you kind of do
this balance?
Because you're out there talking
about conservancy... conserving
everything possible, and yet...
>> SANJAYAN: My mea culpa, the one thing
that I'm not very good at, is I
fly a lot.
>> HINOJOSA: That's what I was
going to say.
>> SANJAYAN: Now, I'm trying to do more
teleconferencing, I'm trying to
use... you know, Cisco has this
thing called Telepresent.
It's a great sort of system
where you can really be in the
same room, essentially, with
people.
But flying is my worst vice.
I drive a Prius, I live in a
pretty small, modest house, I'm
thoughtful about how I heat it,
I'm thoughtful about my energy
use in terms of that.
I watch what I eat.
I'm a very careful consumer,
particularly of fish.
Don't ever eat a big predator,
is a good rule of thumb.
Don't eat something that's older
than you is another good rule of
thumb.
So I try to make the changes in
my own personal life as best as
I can.
>> HINOJOSA: All right.
The one thing that you want all
of us to do today?
>> SANJAYAN: Well, that's easy.
Look-- you know, just go check
out the Nature Conservancy's Web
site.
It's nature.org.
It's an easy one.
It will at least get you
thinking and get a conversation
going with people around you.
I think that's fine.
And take a walk today.
Go out there, take a walk today.
I don't care what the weather
is, just do it.
>> HINOJOSA: Okay, and we'll
leave with don't get depressed--
we can do this.
>> SANJAYAN: Please don't get depressed.
It'll never get you out of bed.
>> HINOJOSA: Thank you so much.
>> SANJAYAN: Sure, thank you, Maria.
>> HINOJOSA: Good luck.
Continue the conversation at
wgbh.org/oneonone.
Captioned by
Media Access Group at WGBH
access.wgbh.org
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