May 12, 2010: Last Call: The Rise and Fall of Prohibition

DAN OKRENT IS TACKLINGING THE

PERIOD WHEN AMERICA OUTLAWED

LIQUOR IN HIS NEW BOOK, "LAST

CALL, THE RISE AND FALL OF

PROHIBITION." AND DANIEL

OKRENT IS HERE.

I HAD NO IDEA OF ANY OF THIS.

YOU POINT OUT RIGHT OFF THE

BAT THAT OTHER THAN SLAVERY,

THERE'S NOTHING THAT LIMITED

INDIVIDUAL RIGHTS SO

DRASTICALLY.

HOW DID THIS HAPPEN?

>> AT ALL.

IN THE CONSTITUTION THERE ARE

ONLY TWO THINGS IN THE ENTIRE

CONSTITUTION THAT LIMIT THE

RIGHTS OF INDIVIDUAL.

THE CONSTITUTION LIMITS THE

POWERS OF GOVERNMENT.

BUT IN THIS CASE YOU COULDN'T

OWN SLAVES AND FOR 13 YEARS

YOU COULDN'T GET LIQUOR IN

THIS COUNTRY.

QUITE ASTONISHING.

REQUIRE DIDN'T REALIZE HOW

CLOSELY IT WAS TIED TO THE

WOMEN'S MOVEMENT, THAT IT WAS

REALLY A POWERFUL COALITION.

>> THE SUFFRAGE AMENDMENT AND

THE PROHIBITION AMENDMENT GREW

UP TOGETHER AND --

WOMEN HAD NO LEGAL RIGHTS IN

THE 19th CENTURY.

AND THEY WERE VICTIMIZED BY

SOME REALLY REALLY BAD

DRINKING THAT WAS GOING ON IN

THIS COUNTRY. THE COUNTRY WAS

DROWNING IN DRINK.

THERE WAS A HISTORIAN WHO SAID

THE AMERICAN OF THE MIDDLE

19th CENTURY DRANK FROM THE

CRACK OF DOWN UNTIL THE CRACK

OF DAWN.

BUT THAT WAS THE HUSBAND OR

FATHER WHO WAS OFF AT THE

SALOON SPENDING THE MONEY,

MAYBE LOSING HIS JOB BECAUSE

OF HIS DRUNKENNESS, COMING

HOME AND BEATING THE WIFE AND

CHILDREN, BRINGING HOME

SOMETHING SOME SYPHILIS OF THE

INNOCENTS BECAUSE THERE WERE

BROTHEL AS TACHED TO THE

SALOONS, SO THERE WAS A REAL

REASON FOR THE WOMEN TO WANT

TO CHALLENGE THIS.

SUSAN B. ANTHONY BEGAN AS A

TEMPERANCE WORKER AND THEN

SWITCHED OVER TO SUFFRAGE

BECAUSE YOU COULDN'T SOLVE THE

DRINKING PROBLEM, SHE FELT,

UNTIL WOMEN HAD THE VOTE.

>> WHEN IT DID, THE DAY WHEN

IT WENT INTO EFFECT PEOPLE

WENT LINING UP THE DAY BEFORE,

TO GET LIQUOR.

BANK, THEY'RE BUYING STUFF AT

THE LAST MINUTE.

BUT IT WAS NEVER REALLY OUT OF

PRODUCTION.

>> NOT REALLY.

BUT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WAS

LEGAL, THIS IS IN DETROIT.

THE DAY BEFORE PROHIBITION

BEGAN.

AND IF YOU OWNED LIQUOR AND

YOU HAD IT IN YOUR HOME BEFORE

PROHIBITION BEGAN YOU WERE

ALLOWED TO KEEP IT.

MARY PICKFORD'S MOTHER BOUGHT

AN ENTIRE LIQUOR STORE.

THAT'S ALSO DETROIT AND THAT'S

AFTER A FEDERAL RAID ON AN

UPSTAIRS BREWERY, AND THEY

JUST CRACKED IT OPEN.

>> SO YOU WERE SAYING?

>> THAT MARY PICKIMPORTANT'S

MOTHER AND OTHER INSTANCES, A

GUY IN NEW ORLEANS WALTER

PARKER WHO WAS SO ANGRY ABOUT

PRO HIB IS HE BUILT A TRIPLE

SIZE WINE CELLAR AND GOT 5,000

BOTTLES OF WINE AND DETERMINED

HE WAS GOING TO DRINK ONE

EVERY YEAR --

EVERY NIGHT THAT PROHIBITION

LASTED, AND HE DID.

AND ON THE DAY IT STOPPED HE

STOPPED DRINKING.

THERE'S THAT STRAIN IN

AMERICAN POLITICS IN WHICH

THERE'S THE ASSERTION THAT WE

CAN OPPOSE OUR MORAL STANDARDS

IN SOMEONE ELSE. SO EVEN THE

MOST SINCERE PROHIBITIONISTS

WHO HAD REAL REASON FOR TO

WANT LICKER TO BE GONE, THEY

DIDN'T REALIZE HOW MUCH PEOPLE

WANTED TO HAVE IT.

AND YOU REALLY CAN'T LEGISLATE

AGAINST HUMAN APPETITE.

>> OR MORALS, FOR THAT MATTER.

>> MORALS AT ALL.

AND PEOPLE WILL DO WHAT

THEY'RE GOING TO DO.

AND THERE WAS A STRONG

ECONOMIC INCENTIVE, THERE WERE

PEOPLE WHO COULD MAKE A GREAT

DEAL OF MONEY IN PROHIBITION

AND WHEREVER THERE'S THE

OPPORTUNITY TO TAKE ADVANTAGE

OF PEOPLE'S APPETITES, SOMEONE

WANTING TO MAKE MONEY WILL BE

THERE.

>> YOU TALK ABOUT THE MAFIA,

AND YOU HAVE THIS PICTURE OF

AL CAPONE WITH THE POLICE

CHIEF IN CHICAGO.

>> THE AMAZING THING TO ME

ABOUT CAPONE, HE MADE HIS

CAREER BECAUSE HE WAS A GREAT

P. R. MAN.

HOW OLD DO YOU THINK AL CAPONE

WAS WHEN HE TOOK OVER CHICAGO?

>> I DON'T KNOW.

40.

>> HE WHAT IS 25, HE WAS A

KID, AND HE WAS DONE BEFORE HE

WAS 30.

BUT HE'S THE FIGURE WHO STAYS

WITH US BECAUSE HE HAD THIS

BEFORE SENSE OF PUBLIC

RELATIONS, THERE WE JUST SAW

HIM STANDING WITH THE ONE

TRULY HONEST COP IN CHICAGO,

BECAUSE HE KNEW THAT WOULD BE

GOOD FOR THE REPUTATION.

>> THERE WAS A GREAT DEAL OF

HYPOCRISY AT THE TIME TOO

BECAUSE PEOPLE WERE STILL

MAKING AN EFFORT TO GET

ALCOHOL.

>> THERE WERE TWO KINDS OF

DRIES, ATHE POLITICIANS WHO

WERE ON THE SIDE PROVE HIB IS

WERE CALLED, THERE WERE THE

DRY DRIES WHO REALLY BELIEVED

IN IT AND THEN THERE WERE THE

WET DRYS WHO VOTED THAT WAY

BUT CONTINUED TO DRINK.

THERE WAS AN OFFICIAL BOOTLEGER

INSIDE THE SENATE OFFICE

BUILDING.

BY ONE RELIABLE MEASURE OF

THEIR OWN THREE TRULY DRY

SENATORS, THE REST WERE HAPPY

TO DRINK ILLEGALLY WHILE

IMPOSING THIS LAW ON THE

NATION.

>> AND THEY HAD ALL KINDS OF

WAYS OF CONCEALING IT, BECAUSE

LICK CORE IS BULK.

>> YOU HAD TO BE ABLE TO MOVE

THINGS FROM ONE CITY TO

ANOTHER.

IF HAVE YOU TO GET PRETTY

BOSTON TO NEW YORK OR FROM

PHILADELPHIA TO CHICAGO, YOU

NEED SOME ALLIES IN THE OTHER

PLACE TO MOVE THOSE TRUCKS

ALONG.

TRUCKS LIKE THIS ONE, WHICH

WAS SO-CALLED A LUMBER TRUCK

BUT OBVIOUSLY ISN'T A LUMBER

TRUCK, THAT'S IN LOS ANGELES.

PEOPLE WERE INGENIUS IN THEIR

EFFORTS TO GET LIQUOR.

>> I WAS TOTALLY IGNORANT

ABOUT THIS PERIOD, BUT THE

GREAT DEPRESSION IS REALLY

WHAT TANKED IT.

>> THE MARKET CRASHES, THE

DEPRESSION COMES IN, INCOMES

AND REVENUES PLUMMET.

AND THERE WERE SOME PEOPLE

BOTH ON THE RIGHT AND LEFT,

SOME WHO DIDN'T CARE ABOUT

PROHIBITION BUT DIDN'T WANT TA

PAY THEIR NEW TAXES, IF WE CAN

ONLY BRING BACK BEER, THEN WE

WON'T HAVE IN INCOME TAX ANY

LONGER.

AND IN FACT, IT BROUGHT IN

OVER A QUARTER BILLION DOLLARS

IN THE VERY FIRST YEAR.

>> AND CREATED ALL THESE JOBS.

>> LIQUOR AND THE DISSPELLING

BREWERIES WERE THE FIFTH

LARGERS INDUSTRY IN THE U.S.

AT THE TIME PROHIBITION WAS

INSTITUTED.

AND BRINGING IT BACK IN 1933

PUT TENS OF THOUSANDS OF

PEOPLE BACK TO WORK.

>> DID THE DRINKING PROBLEMS

START ANEW?

>> THE MOST IRONIC THING ABOUT

IT, I THINK IT BECAME HARDER

TO GET A DRAINING AFTER APPEAL

THAN DURING PROHIBITION.

YOU DIDN'T HAVE TO HAVE A

LICENSE TO SELL, BECAUSE IT

WAS AGAINST THE LAW SO, YOU

COULD SELL IT ANY TIME,

WHEREVER YOU WANTED TO AND

JUST BRIBE THE COP ON THE BEAT

AND YOU WERE OKAY.

AFTER REPEAL COMES IN, THEN

THERE'S CLOSING HOURS AND YOU

CAN'T BE OPEN ON SUNDAY, AND

YOU CAN'T BE NEAR A CHURCH.

AND THE BLUE LAWS, AGE LIMITS,

AND SO IT BECAME SOMETHING

THAT THE PEOPLE WHO WERE

SELLING LIQUOR REALLY HAD TO

PAY ATTENTION TO.

>> PLEASURE TO SEE YOU.

THAT IS IT FOR "GREATER

BOSTON".

WE'LL BE BACK TOMORROW NIGHT

AT 7:00.

I'M EMILY ROONEY.

GOOD NIGHT.