Mar. 31, 2010: Casino rallies at the State House

>> TONIGHT ON "GREATER BOSTON",
ECONOMIC BOON OR FALSE
PROMISES?
THE CASINO DEBATE HEATS UP AT
THE STATE HOUSE.
PLUS DRIVING THE T, NEW HEAD
RICHARD DAVEY ON HIS PLANS TO
KEEP THE MBTA ON THE RIGHT
TRACK.
AND... SHE'S A CELEBRATED
RISING JAZZ STAR.
MEET SINGER SONGWRITER LIZZ
WRIGHT.

>> GOOD EVENING.
I'M JARED BOWEN IN FOR EMILY
ROONEY.
WITH THOUSANDS OF CONSTRUCTION
JOBS AT STAKE, TRADE UNIONS HI
BEACON HILL IN FORCE TODAY
LAYING THE GROUND WORK FOR
HOUSE SPEAKER DeLEO'S MUCH
ANTICIPATED CASINO
LEGALIZATION BILL.
EXPECTED TO BE ANNOUNCED
TOMORROW, IT COULD SET THE
STAGE FOR A FINAL DECISION ON
CASINO GAMBLING IN
MASSACHUSETTS AFTER YEARS OF
LOBBYING AND DEBATE.
SLOT MACHINES ARE ABOUT
PAYCHECKS, NOT PAYOUTS, THAT
WAS THE MESSAGE TO
CONSTRUCTION WORKERS SWARMING
BEACON HILL THIS MORNING TO
LOBBY FOR CASINOS.

>> SO WE HAVE A CHANCE TODAY,
UNLIKE ANY OTHER STATE IN THE
COUNTRY, TO CREATE A JOB BILL
THAT ONCE IT PASSED
IMMEDIATELY PUTS PEOPLE BACK
TO WORK, WORKING ON JOB SITES.
AND YOU NEED TO EXPLAIN THAT
STORY TODAY.

>> ONCE FIRED UP, UNION
ELECTRICIANS LIKE ROBERT HIT
THE HALLWAYS, LOBBYING FOR THE
MUCH ANTICIPATED GAMBLING
BILL. THE PROPOSAL TO BE
UNVEILED TOMORROW IS EXPECTED
TO CALL FOR TWO NEW RESORT
STYLE CASINOS, AND TO HAVE
SLOT MACHINES INSTALLED AT THE
FOUR EXISTING RACE TRACKS IN
MASSACHUSETTS.

>> IF YOU WANT TO GAMBLE
YOU'RE GOING TO GO TO
CONNECTICUT OR NOW NEW
HAMPSHIRE, TO HAVE THAT
OPPORTUNITY FOR OUR RESIDENTS
TO GO BACK TO WORK AND BE PART
OF THAT INDUSTRY IS SOMETHING
THAT I THINK IS GOING TO BE
HELPFUL.

>> SPINALI STRUCK OUT AT THE
MAJORITY WHIP'S OFFICE, BUT
DID MANAGE TO TRACK TOWN
SENATOR HELD LUND IN THE
HOLIDAY.
HE MADE THE PITCH, BUT THE
SENATOR WASN'T CONVINCED.

>> I DON'T THINK WE HAVE TO GO
DOWN A ROAD THAT MIKE'S US
LIKE EVERY OTHER STATE AND
RELY ON GAMING TO PLUG BUDGET
HOLES.

>> DIE-HARD OPPONENTS ALSO HAD
THEIR SAY AT THE STATE HOUSE.
SHE MOCKED DeLEO'S PROPOSAL AS
A SECRET SLOTS BILL BECAUSE IT
WON'T BE SUBJECT TO PUBLIC
HEARINGS.

>> THE SUPER SECRET SLOTS BILL
WILL BE RELEASED TOMORROW ON
APRIL FOOLS DAY.
THE GAMBLING SPECIAL INTERESTS
ARE HOPING THE COMMONWEALTH
WILL BE THEIR NEXT JOKE.

>> SHE SAYS THE FALL YOU FROM
LEGALIZED CASINOS WILL BE
ANYTHING BUT FUNNY.

>> WE HAVEN'T LOOKED AT THE
TRUE COSTS, NONE OF THAT HAS
BEEN CALCULATED.
PEOPLE THAT ARE LOOKING FOR
JOBS, ABSOLUTELY THEY SHOULD
HAVE A VOICE IN WHAT THEY'RE
LOOKING FOR.
WE'RE LOOKING FOR JOBS WITH
JUSTICE.
WE'RE LOOKING FOR JOBS THAT
LIFT UP OUR ECONOMY.
WE WANT AN ECONOMY THAT IS
BASED ON WINNERS, NOT LOSERS.

>> WITH ME NOW ARE LAURA
EVERETT OF THE MASSACHUSETTS
COUNCIL OF CHURCHES WHO
OPPOSES GAMBLING.
AND MICHAEL MONAHAN OF IBEW
LOCAL 103 WHO SUPPORTS CASINOS
MAINLY FOR THE JOBS THEY'LL
BRING.
WELCOME TO BOTH OF YOU.

>> THANK YOU.

>> MICHAEL, WE JUST OBVIOUSLY
SAW THE PEOPLE KNOCKING ON
DOORS, YOUR COLLEAGUES UP
THERE.
IN THE INSTANCES WE SAW IT
DIDN'T GO SO WELL.
SO I'M WONDERING WHAT WAS
REPORTED BACK THIS AFTERNOON.
HOW DO YOU GAUGE THE CLIMATE
RIGHT NOW?

>> WE'RE GOING TO GO THROUGH
ALL THE REPORT CARDS THAT WERE
DELIVERED BACK.
AS YOU KNOW, WE HAD DAY
THOUSAND PEOPLE AT OUR UNION
HALL THIS MORNING AND WE
BUSSED THEM UP TO THE STATE
HOUSE TO LOBBY ON BEHALF OF
LEGALIZING THE GAMBLING BILL,
THAT AS MENTION LD BE FILED
TOMORROW BY SPEAKER DeLEO.

>> WHAT EFFORT DO YOU GO
THROUGH IF EARLY REPORT CARDS
ARE COMING BACK THAT IT'S NOT
IN YOUR FAVOR?
ARE YOU GOING TO KEEP HITTING
BEACON HILL?

>> ABSOLUTELY.
THERE WILL BE A FORMAL BILL
FILED TOMORROW AND WE'RE GOING
TO ADVOCATE FOR ITS PES AGE
TOMORROW, FOR THE REASONS THAT
YOU STATED.
IT'S A NO BRAINER.
THERE'S A BILLION DOLLARS
ANNUALLY THAT FLOWS FROM
MASSACHUSETTS TO CONNECTICUT.
THERE'S A HALF A BILLION
DOLLARS THAT THAT INDUSTRY
SPENDS IN CONNECTICUT ANNUALLY
FROM FLOWERS TO OTHER SERVICES
THAT GO THERE.
THERE'S 19,000 PEOPLE EMPLOYED
IN CONNECTICUT.

>> LET ME BRING LAURA IN HERE.
WE SHOULD SAY ALL THESE
NUMBERS ARE IN DISPUTE,
BECAUSE JOB NUMBERS THAT ARE
DIFFERENT, THE PROFITS THAT GO
TO CONNECTICUT, WE'RE ALL
PLAYING WITH NUMBERS, BUT THEY
ARE SIZABLE NUMBERS.
SO WHEN YOU HEAR SOMETHING
LIKE THIS, WHY DO YOU THINK IT
ISN'T A GOOD IDEA TO BRING
THIS REVENUE IN THE STATE AT
THIS TIME?

>> I THINK THE DISCREPANCY
BETWEEN THE NUMBERS THAT
YOU'RE HEARING IS PART OF THE
REASON WHY UNITED TO STOP
SLOTS IN MASSACHUSETTS HAS
CALLED FOR AN INDEPENDENT COST
BENEFIT ANALYSIS.
THERE ISN'T CLARITY ABOUT HOW
MANY JOBS THIS MAY CREATE, OR
HOW MANY JOBS WILL BE
DISPLACED BY CASINOS PUTING
SMALL BUSINESSES OUT IN THE
AREAS WHERE THEY COME.
WE DON'T HAVE A CLEAR SENSE OF
WHAT THE REVENUE WILL BE.
AND THE BEST WE KNOW IS THAT
IT WILL BE A $90 MILLION HIT
TO THE LOTTERY.
AT MINIMUM BEFORE WE LEGALIZE
SOMETHING --

>> IS THERE A BAR THAT YOU'RE
LOOKING FOR IN WHICH IT WOULD
BE ACCEPTABLE TO ALLOW CASINOS
HERE?

>> THE ENTIRE DEBATE, WHETHER
IT'S ABOUT SLOTS AT CASINOS OR
SLOTS AT RACE TRACKS, IS ABOUT
SLOT MACHINES.
THIS IS THE MOST PREDER TO OF
THE GAMBLING PRODUCTS
AVAILABLE ON THE MARKET.
IF PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BECOME
ADDICTED, THEY BECOME ADDICTED
FIVE TIMES FASTER WITH SLOT
MACHINES.
THAT'S WHY THE INDUSTRY IS SO
FOCUSED ON BRINGING SLOTS TO
MASSACHUSETTS.
THE GOLF COURSES, THE STORES,
THEY'RE JUST WINDOW DRESSING
FOR THE MOST PREDER TO
GAMBLING PRODUCT ON THE MARKET
--
PREDATORY GAMBLING PRODUCT ON
THE MARKET.
WE'VE GOT GREAT CONCERNS,
WHERE PEOPLE CAN PLAY TO
EXTINCTION.

>> MICHAEL, YOU WERE TALKING
ABOUT JOBS, AND RIGHT NOW I
UNDERSTAND ABOUT 30% OF THE
PEOPLE IN YOUR UNION ARE OUT
OF JOBS AT THIS MOMENT.
SO IS THIS WHAT'S REALLY
DRIVING IT?
DO YOU HAVE A SPECIAL INTEREST
RIGHT NOW TO GET THESE PEOPLE
EMPLOYED?

>> ABSOLUTELY, THE NUMBERS ARE
ACCURATE, ABOUT 33% OF OUR
MEMBERSHIP IS OUT OF WORK.
AND SOME LOCAL UNIONS IT OVER
50%.
IN NATIONAL PUBLIC RADIO PUTS
OUR INDUSTRY AS A WHOLE,
CONSTRUCTION, AS ABOUT 60%.
SO IT'S DIFFERENT FOR THE
TRADES AND SO ON AND SO FOLT.
BUT THE DATA THAT I'VE READ ON
THE LOTTERY ISSUE IN
CONNECTICUT, THEY TOOK A DIP
FOR ONE YEAR AND IT WAS BACK
UP TO WHERE IT HAD BEEN AND
HAS CLIMBED STEADILY AFTER
THAT.

>> THESE TEMPORARY JOBS
THOUGH?
YOU THINK ABOUT THEM AS
CONSTRUCTION JOBS, WHEN
EVERYTHING GOES UP, ESPECIALLY
WHEN YOU'RE WORKING WITH
ELECTRICIANS.
WHERE DO THEY BECOME MORE
VIABLE PERMANENT CAREER
OPTIONS?

>> IN CONSTRUCTION EVERY DAY
YOU GO TO WORK YOU HOPEFULLY
PROGRESS IN WHAT YOU'VE BEEN
HIRED TO DO.
SO IT'S ONE OF THE ONLY JOBS
THAT YOU WORK YOURSELF OUT OF.
SO ANYTHING IN CONSTRUCTION IS
TEMPORARY, AND YOU HOPE THAT
THERE'S ANOTHER JOB TO GO TO.
THERE'S AN ARGUMENT TO BE MADE
THAT THE SPINOFF EFFECT OF
THIS BILL WITH THE
CONSTRUCTION OF THESE RESORT
CASINOS, THAT IT'S GOING TO
LEAD TO MORE WORK.
AND THE SMALL BUSINESSES IN
AND AROUND THE CONNECTICUT
STORY HAS BEEN JUST THE
OPPOSITE.
THAT THE LOCAL BUSINESSES HAVE
FLOURISHED.
LIKE I SAID, THERE'S A HALF A
BILLION DOLLARS SPENT ON LOCAL
BUSINESS AND SERVICES IN THE
CONNECTICUT SCENARIO.
AND THOSE ARE ALL THE REASONS
TO DO IT.
BUT EVEN IF THE NUMBERS ARE
OFF, LET'S SAY THE NUMBERS ARE
OFF AND LET'S CUT THEM IN HALF,
WHAT OTHER INDUSTRY IS IN OUR
AREA RIGHT NOW THAT'S GOING TO
OFFER 10,000 JOBS TO
MASSACHUSETTS RESIDENTS?
THERE'S NOBODY KNOCKING ON THE
DOOR OFFERING 10,000 JOBS.

>> IT DOES ALSO OFFER TAX
REVENUE.
ANECDOTALLY WE'RE HEADED TO
MOHEGAN SUN TOMORROW FOR A
SPECIAL WE'RE AIRING IN A
COUPLE WEEKS.

>> IN A COUPLE WEEKS THIS MAY
ALREADY BE DONE.

>> BUT IN TALKING TO THEM,
THERE ARE BENEFITS FOR PEOPLE
COMING IN, THERE ARE BENEFITS
FOR THE AREA BUSINESSES AND
RESIDENTS.
SO IF THAT DOES PROP UP A
COMMUNITY LIKE IT DONE IN
NORWICH, CONNECTICUT, HOW DO
YOU ARGUE AGAINST THAT?

>> I THINK WE HAVE TO LOOK AT
OTHER STATES.
LOOK AT CRIPPLE CREEK,
COLORADO.
AS SOON AS CASINOS WERE
LEGALIZED, WITHIN SEVEN YEARS
OF CASINOS IN DOWNTOWN CRIPPLE
CREEK, 83% OF THE SMALL
BUSINESSES AND RESTAURANTS OF
OUT OF, WERE OUT OF BUSINESS.
IN ATLANTA CITY WHEN CASINOS
WERE LEGALIZED,' 70% OF THE
FREE STANDING RESTAURANTS
OUTSIDE THE CASINO WERE GONE
IN ONE YEAR.
CASINO, SELF CONTAINED.
THEY WANT PATRONS TO GO IN AND
SPEND ALL OF THEIR MONEY
THERE.
IF I CAN SPEND 799 AT AN ALL
YOU CAN EAT BUFFET RATHER THAN
$20 AT THE LOCAL RESTAURANT,
WE KNOW WHERE PEOPLE ARE GOING
TO GO.
THIS IS NOT A BOON FOR
INDUSTRIES OUTSIDE THE CASINO,
BUT REALLY WHETHER WE WANT TO
PROP UP AN INDUSTRY THAT PUTS
OTHER BUSINESSES OUT.

>> MICHAEL, THE OTHER ARGUMENT
AGAINST CASINOS THAT PEOPLE
HAVE RAISED IS THAT STATES
THAT DO HAVE CASINOS LIKE
CONNECTICUT, THERE ARE HIGHER
TAXES IN THOSE STATES THAN WE
HAVE HERE IN MASSACHUSETTS AT
THIS POINT.
SO YOU LOOK AT THOSE NUMBERS
AND YOU WONDER IS IT REALLY
WORTH IT AFTER ALL.

>> I THINK IT IS, BUT I HAVE
TO ADDRESS WHAT SHE SAYS.
IF I'M GOING TO GO OUT TO
DINNER WITH MY WIFE AND KIDS,
I'M GOING TO GO TO THE PLACE
AROUND THE CORNER FROM MY
HOUSE.
I'M NOT GOING TO DRIVE FOR
SUFFOLK DOWNS 7.99 ALL YOU CAN
EAT BUFFET.
THAT'S LUDICROUS.
AND THE JOBS PIECE RIGHT NOW,
WHAT INDUSTRY IN MASSACHUSETTS
IS OFFERING THE RESIDENTS
10,000 JOBS?
AND I BELIEVE THAT THIS BILL
WILL SPEAK TO LOCAL AID AND
THAT'S JUST THE PERMANENT
JOBS.
NOW, THE CONSTRUCTION INDUSTRY
IS FLAT, UNFORTUNATELY IT'S
FLAT.
THE COMMERCIAL REAL ESTATE
MARKET 2010 THEY SAY IT'S
GOING TO BE AWFUL.
THE RESIDENTIAL MARKET IS NOT
GOOD.
THANK GOD FOR THE HOSPITALS
AND THE BIOTECH IN TRANSIT.
BUT THIS IS AN ECONOMIC ENGINE
THAT THIS STATE COULD USE AND
BENEFIT FOR YEARS.

>> SO YOU WOULDN'T NECESSARILY
BE AS BEHIND IT IF IT WERE
FIVE YEARS AGO WHEN THE
ECONOMY WAS BOOMING?

>> WE WERE BEHIND IT FOUR
YEARS AGO, WE WERE BEHIND IT
LAST YEAR.
WE'VE ALSO BEEN BEHIND IT.
WE THINK IT'S AN ECONOMIC
ENGINE THAT THE STATE SHOULD
SERIOUSLY LOOK AT, AND
HOPEFULLY THE BILL US PASSED.

>> I WANT TO ASK ABOUT THE
SUPER SECRET SLOTS.
THIS IS AN INTERESTING
CONCEPT.
YOU'RE SAYING THAT THE
LEGISLATURE IS BEING
DISINGENUOUS.
DO YOU REALLY BELIEVE THAT
THEY'RE NOT GOING TO MAKE THE
PUBLIC AWARE OF WHAT'S
HAPPENING?

>> WE HAVEN'T HAD A PUBLIC
HEARING ON THE BILL.
SO THE BILL PRESUMABLY IS
GOING TO COME OUT TOMORROW.
WE DON'T KNOW HOW MANY
LOCATIONS FOR FREE STANDING
CASINOS.
WE DON'T KNOW HOW MANY SLOT
MACHINES WILL BE PUT AT
TRACKS.
WE DON'T KNOW OF THE TRIBES
THAT ARE LEGALIZED IN
MASSACHUSETTS, HOW MANY OF
THOSE FEDERALLY RECOGNIZED
TRIBES ARE LOOKING AT CASINOS.
THAT'S UP TO EIGHT POSSIBLE
GAMBLING LOCATIONS.
WE DON'T KNOW ABOUT MITIGATION
COSTS.
WE DON'T KNOW ABOUT THE CRIMES
BILL THAT WE'D NEED TO HAVE IN
PLACE THAT THE ATTORNEY
GENERAL HAS CALLED FOR.
WE DON'T KNOW, WE DON'T HAVE
ANY PROJECTION NUMBERS ABOUT
WHAT THE INCREASED NEED IN
SOCIAL SERVICES WOULD BE
THERE'S A LOT THAT HAS TO BE
DONE IN ORDER TO PUT THIS IN
PLACE AND WE HAVEN'T HAD ANY
OF THOSE HEARINGS.
AND LEGISLATORS ARE SUPPOSED
TO VOTE ON IT IN A FEW DAYS.

>> WE'LL BE LOOKING AT THE
NUMBERS TOO, SO THANK YOU BOTH
FOR COMING.
AND "GREATER BOSTON" AND WGBH
RADIO AS I MENTIONED WILL
EXPLORE THE ISSUE OF CASINO
GAMBLING AND WHAT IT MEANS TO
MASSACHUSETTS IN A SPECIAL
SERIES CALLED THE LAST RESORT.
LEARN MORE ABOUT IT AND ADD
YOUR VOICE TO THE CONVERSATION
AT OUR WEBSITE.
WHEN WE CONTINUE, THE NEW MAN
ABOARD AND DRIVING THE MBTA.