July 20, 2010: Tim Cahill

>> Rooney: TONIGHT ON

"GREATER BOSTON," THE HOT

ISSUE TODAY IN THE RACE

FOR GOVERNOR.

THE M-CAST, INDEPENDENT

CANDIDATE TIM CAHILL

SPEAKS OUT.

PLUS BIOGRAPHER HOWARD

BRIENTD ON THE LIFE OF A

BASEBALL LEGEND, HENRY

AARON.

AND THE NEWEST WAY TO

ENJOY ONE OF THE TREATS OF

SUMMER.

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>> Rooney: GOOD EVENING.

TODAY TIM CAHILL, THE

INDEPENDENT CANDIDATE FOR

GOVERNOR, SAYS GOVERNOR

DEVAL PATRICK'S MOVE TO

REPLACE THE STATE-WIDE

CURRICULUM STANDARDS WITH

FEDERAL ONES IS

POLITICALLY MOTIVATED.

CAHILL SAYS THE TIMING IS

SUSPECT, AS THE MASS

TEACHERS' ASSOCIATION

WHICH HAS ENDORSED

PATRICK, HAS OUTSPOKEN

CRITICS OF THE M-CAST

EXAMS WHICH COULD

EVENTUALLY BE ELIMINATED

IF THE FEDERAL STANDARDS

TAKE HOLD.

IT IS THE LATEST ISSUE

THAT CONTINUES TO GENERATE

CONTROVERSY IN THE

GUBERNATORIAL CAMPAIGN.

TONIGHT TIM CAHILL JOINS

US.

WELCOME.

>> THANK YOU.

>> Rooney: I'M HONESTLY

TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT

THE TO-DO IS ALL ABOUT.

WE WERE TALKING TO A STATE

REPRESENT, MARTY WALSTON,

AND HE SAYS THE M-CASTS

ARE NOT GOING TO GO AWAY.

STUDENTS STILL HAVE TO

PASS THEM IN ORDER TO

GRADUATE.

SO WHAT IS THE ISSUE?

>> IF THE CURRICULUM

CHANGES, AND THE

CURRICULUM HAS BEEN BUILT

TOWARDS, YOU KNOW, GETTING

STUDENTS TO PASS --

>> Rooney: THEY DENY

THAT.

>> BAIT AND SWITCH, MAYBE.

>> Rooney: THEY DENIED

THAT THEY TEACH TO THE

TESTS.

>> BUT OBVIOUSLY THE

CURRICULUM ALLOWS TEACHING

SO STUDENTS CAN PASS IT

BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO PASS

THE TEST.

>> Rooney: OKAY.

>> WHAT CONCERNS ME IS

WHETHER WE CHANGE THE

M-CASTS, EVEN IF WE KEEP

IT OR LOWER OUR STANDARDS,

IT WILL BE HARDER --

>> Rooney: WHAT MAKES

YOU THINK THE STANDARD IS

LOWER?

>> THE CORE CURRICULUM IS

NOT AS INTENSE.

>> Rooney: I DON'T KNOW.

I HAVEN'T SEEN IT.

>> WHAT I'VE SEEN OF IT SO

FAR.

I HAVEN'T READ THROUGH THE

WHOLE THING.

KIDS AND THE FIRST GRADE

LEARNING HOW TO

PHONETICALLY SAY WORDS,

NOW IT IS IN THE FOURTH

AND FIFTH GRADE.

LESS LITERARY READINGS FOR

STUDENTS AND LESS RIGOROUS

STANDARDS.

>> Rooney: MORE CREATIVE

STUFF?

>> YEAH.

THE THINGS WE WERE TRYING

TO GET AWAY FROM AND THAT

HAVE HELPED MASSACHUSETTS

STUDENTS RISE TO THE VERY,

VERY TOP, NOT OM IN THE

COUNTRY, BUT IN THE ENTIRE

WORLD.

IN MATH SCIENCE, AND

HOPEFULLY IN HISTORY.

THE OTHER THING THAT

BOTHERS MY IS TWO THINGS:

WE'RE GOING TO BE TAKING

OUR ORDERS FROM

WASHINGTON, D.C.

AND IT IS TOUGH ENOUGH

GETTING THROUGH THE

BUREAUCRACY IN

MASSACHUSETTS, AND NOW

WE'LL HAVE TO GET THROUGH

THE GOVERNMENT

BUREAUCRACY.

AND WE'LL HAVE TO REWRITE

SOME OF THE TESTS.

SO WE'RE THROWING MORE

MONEY AT A PROBLEM WHICH

WE SEEM TO HAVE SOLVED IN

MASSACHUSETTS.

IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.

>> Rooney: AS YOU KNOW,

GOVERNOR DEVAL PATRICK HAS

MADE EDUCATION ONE OF THE

CORNERSTONES OF HIS

GOVERNORSHIP.

HE RAN ON THAT AND SHAS

TALKED ABOUT IT EVER

SINCE.

I HEARD JIM BROWDY ASKING

CHARLIE BAKER THIS, WHAT

WOULD BE HIS MOTIVATION?

>> HE IS TAKING HIS ORDERS

FROM WASHINGTON.

THERE IS NO QUESTION HE IS

FOLLOWING PRESIDENT

OBAMA'S DESIGN.

>> Rooney: YOU THINK

PRESIDENT OBAMA CALLED HIM

UP --

>> WELL, HE IS FOLLOWING

HIS LEAD.

THERE IS A CARROT OF

MONEY.

>> Rooney: WHO GETS THAT

MONEY?

>> I DON'T KNOW.

>> Rooney: IF HIS STATE

ADOPTS THE CURRICULUM,

WE'RE IN LINE FOR

$250 MILLION?

>> WE'RE IN LINE FOR IT.

AND I THINK IT IS A STEP

BACKWARDS, NOT A STEP

FORWARD.

IT IS GREAT THAT THE REST

OF THE COUNTRY IS

FOLLOWING OUR LEAD.

WHAT I'VE BEEN TOLD THAT

THESE STANDARDS ARE

CLOSEST TO MASSACHUSETTS,

BUT WHY SHOULD WE EVEN OPT

IN IF WE HAVE THE BEST

STANDARDS.

I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS

RELATED TO THE UNION

ENDORSEMENT, BUT I KNOW

THERE ARE A LOT OF

TEACHERS THAT BELIEVE THE

M-CASTS HAVE WORKED.

>> Rooney: AND OTHERS

HAVE DREADED IT.

>> RIGHT.

BUT I THINK THE PLACE IT

WORKED THE BEST, WAS IN

THE CITIES.

IN THE URBAN AREAS, THE

M-CASTS PASS IT PRETTY

EASILY.

LIKE IN QUINCY, WHERE I

LIVE, I THINK M-CASTS HAVE

LEVELLED THE PLAYING FIELD

AND GIVEN URBAN STUDENTS

AND DISADVANTAGED SOME OF

THE LEVELLING.

>> Rooney: I SWORE TO

GOD I WASN'T GOING TO DO

ANOTHER M-CAST STORY AS

LONG AS I LIVED, THEN THIS

ONE COMES ALONG, WHETHER

IT WORKS OR IT DOESN'T

WORK.

I DON'T THINK THE

EDUCATION COMMISSION WOULD

SCRAP THIS.

THEY'RE GOING TO VOTE ON

IT TOMORROW OR THE NEXT

DAY --

>> YEAH.

>> Rooney: IF THEY

DIDN'T THINK IT WAS A FIT.

>> YOU WOULD HOPE SO, BUT

IT IS A SLIPPERY SLOPE.

IT IS MORE ABOUT LOWERING

THE STANDARDS OR CHANGING

THE STANDARDS AND YOU HAVE

SOMETHING THAT WORKS.

>> Rooney: WHY WOULD YOU

DO THAT?

>> BECAUSE THE PRESIDENT

OF THE UNITED STATES WANTS

EVERYBODY TO SORT OF PLAY

BY THE SAME PLAY BOOK.

I DON'T THINK THAT IS A

GOOD THING, EITHER.

I THINK STATES SHOULD BE

ALLOW TO INNOVATE AND

EXPERIMENT.

WHAT WE'VE DONE IN

MASSACHUSETTS HAS WORKED

UNDER MANY ADMINISTRATIONS

AND WE'RE GOING IN THE

RIGHT DIRECTION.

AND IT DOESN'T MAKE ANY

SENSE TO ME WHEN IT IS

WORKING.

IF IT WASN'T WORKING,

THAT'S A DIFFERENT STORY.

IT MAY NOT BE WORKING IN

MISSISSIPPI OR ALABAMA, SO

THEY MAY HAVE TO COME UP.

I DON'T CARE IF IT IS A

DEMOCRATIC OR REPUBLICAN

ADMINISTRATION THAT SAYS

YOU HAVE TO PLAY BY OUR

RULES IN WASHINGTON, D.C.

>> Rooney: THERE IS NO

QUESTION THAT THE PEOPLE

WITH THE M-CASTS HAVE BEEN

DOING BETTER AND BETTER

AND BETTER.

>> TEACHERS ARE TEACHERS.

IT WAS A UNIFORM STANDARD.

AND WE KNOW, WE HIRE KIDS,

AND WE WANT THEM TO BE

ABLE IN OUR OFFICE TO BE

ABLE TO WRITE, EXPRESS

THEMSELVES, ADD, SUBTRACT,

AND BE ABLE TO DO THE

MATH.

THAT IS IMPORTANT WITH

KIDS COMING OUT OF THE

SCHOOLS GOING TO

UNIVERSITIES.

I THINK THE BAR HAS BEEN

SET VERY HIGH.

MY CHILDREN BENEFITED FOR

HIGHER, TOUGHER STANDARDS.

WHETHER IT WAS TEACHING

FOR THE TESTS, BUT I

BELIEVE YOU NEED TO HAVE

SOME SET OF STANDARDS.

WE SHOULD ALWAYS TRY TO

RAISE THE BAR.

BECAUSE I THINK YOUNG

PEOPLE WILL ALWAYS TRY TO

ACHIEVE IT IF WE SET THE

BAR VERY HIGH.

>> Rooney: ON OTHER

ISSUE, WHICH IS TAXES,

YOU'VE SAID YOU FAVOR A

ROLLBACK.

WOULD YOU GO -- THE

QUESTION I WANT TO ASK --

THE QUESTION IS GOING TO

BE ON THE BALLOT, AND IT'S

GOING TO GO FROM 6.25% TO

3%.

THAT'S A DRAMATIC CUT.

>> I DON'T SUPPORT THAT.

>> Rooney: YOU SAID YOU

FAVORED SOMETHING IN

BETWEEN, LIKE 5%, WHICH IS

WHAT THE VOTERS VOTED ON.

BUT WHAT IF IT GOES TO 3%?

>> WE'LL HAVE TO TRY TO

ENFORCE IT AS BEST YOU

CAN.

>> Rooney: HOW WOULD YOU

ENFORCE IT.

>> WE'D HAVE TO MAKE CUTS.

>> Rooney: WHERE?

LIKE EDUCATION?

>> EDUCATION, LOCAL AID,

AND TRANSPORTATION HEALTH

CARE.

IT IS EATING UP MORE AND

MORE OF OUR BUDGET.

AT 3%, THERE COULD NO

SACRED COWS ANYWHERE.

AT 5%, IT MAY BE

DIFFICULT, BUT IT IS

SOMETHING WE WILL HAVE TO

PHASE INTO.

BUT I THINK WE NEED TO

GROW OUR ECONOMY.

IF WE DON'T GROW OUR

ECONOMY AND ADD JOBS,

WE'LL BE CUTTING ANYWHERE.

>> Rooney: EVEN THE

MASSACHUSETTS SCHOOL

BUILDING ASSOCIATION --

WOULDN'T THAT BE SOMETHING

YOU HAVE TO CUT.

GOING AROUND TO THE

COMMUNITIES AND GIVING

THEM MILLIONS AND MILLIONS

OF DOLLARS?

>> WE WERE ABLE TO DO IT

AT 5%.

THAT'S WHY I THINK 5% --

>> Rooney: 5% WHAT?

>> 5% SALES TAX.

BECAUSE WE GET ONE OF

THOSE CENTS, AND M.B.A.

GETS ONE OF THE CENTS.

5% -- I THINK IT WORKED

VERY WELL.

THAT'S WHY I OPPOSED

BRINGING IT UP TO 6.25,

BECAUSE ALL YOU DID WAS

AGGRAVATE AND ALIENATE

PEOPLE.

SO IT IS THE EXTREMES THAT

DON'T WORK.

IT IS THE MIDDLE GROUND

THAT I'M TRYING TO FIGHT

FOR AS AN INDEPENDENT,

WHERE MOST PEOPLE WANT.

YOU GET THE SERVICES, AT A

REASONABLE COST.

>> Rooney: BUT THERE

ISN'T GOING TO BE A MIDDLE

GROUND?

>> WELL, IF IT PASSES,

THERE WON'T BE A MIDDLE

GROUND.

YOU HAVE TO WORKTHE

LEGISLATURE BECAUSE THEY

WOULD STILL BE THE ONES

THAT WOULD IMPLEMENT IT ON

JANUARY 1st IF IT

PASSES.

IT IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN

PEOPLE DON'T LISTEN.

WHEN THE LEGISLATURE OR

GOVERNMENT DOESN'T LISTEN

TO PEOPLE.

AND PEOPLE SAID LAST YEAR,

DON'T RAISE THE SALES TAX.

THEY RAISED IT ANYWAYS.

AND PEOPLE STARTED GOING

TO NEW HAMPSHIRE.

>> Rooney: SOMEONE OUGHT

TO HAVE SECOND GUESSED

CARLA HELMS.

>> Reporter: WE GO FROM

6.25 TO 3%, WHEN WE SHOULD

HAVE STAYED AT 5% ALL

ALONE.

I THINK GOING FORWARD, I

THINK THAT'S REASONABLE.

AND I THINK THAT'S WHAT WE

NEED TO GROW BUSINESSES.

THAT'S THE KEY FOR ME.

IT IS NOT JUST THE CUTTING

OF TAXES.

IT IS WHAT IT DOES.

IF IT GROWS JOBS AND HELPS

SMALL BUSINESSES AND

ALLOWS PEOPLE TO KEEP SOME

MORE OF THEIR MONEY THAT

THEY REINVEST OR SPEND,

THAT'S GOING TO HELP THE

ECONOMY.

THAT'S THE ONLY WAY WE'RE

GOING TO GET BACK TO THAT

REVENUE NUMBER THAT WILL

ALLOW US TO MAKE OUR

INVESTMENTS AND FULLY FUND

THE GOVERNMENT SERVICE WE

WANT TO MEET.

>> Rooney: AND YOU SAID

YOU'RE IN FAVOR OF GIVING

BREAKS TO SMALL BUSINESSES

TO HIRE MORE BUSINESSES.

WITH THIS FORCED HEALTH

CARE SITUATION, THEY'RE

SAYING IT IS EASIER FOR ME

AND MORE LUCRATIVE FOR ME

TO PAY THE PENALTY.

>> IT ALWAYS HAS BEEN.

>> Rooney: SO THERE IS

NO INCENTIVE FOR THEM TO.

>> THAT'S THE PROBLEM.

AND AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL,

IF THE FEDERAL LAW PASSES,

EVEN MORE INCENTIVE TO

DROP.

>> Rooney: WHAT KIND OF

A TAX BREAK WOULD YOU

GIVE?

>> WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO DO

IS BRING INCOME TAXES DOWN

TO 5%, AND CAPITAL GAINS

DOWN TO SOMETHING LOWER

THAN IT IS.

>> Rooney: FEDERAL IS

GOING TO GO UP?

>> IT'S GOING TO GO UP.

SO THAT WOULD GIVE US A

COMPETITIVE ADVANTAGE.

I WANT TO HELP THE SMALL

BUSINESSES THAT ADD JOBS.

BUT I WANT TO DO IT ACROSS

THE BOARD, NOT AS OUR

GOVERNOR HAS DONE,

FAVORING INDUSTRIES.

HE FAVORS HIGH-TECH, BUT

HE DOESN'T FAVOR CASINOS.

HE WILL SPEND MONEY HERE

IF IT IS HIGH-TECH, BUT

NOT IF IT IS CASINOS.

I JUST WANT TO CREATE

JOBS --

>> Rooney: HE'S IN FAVOR

OF CREATING JOBS IN

CASINOS.

>> BUT HE HAS HELD BACK IN

SPENDING MONEY AT THE

CASINO.

REALLY AT THE END OF THE

DAY, IT IS ABOUT CREATING

AS MANY AS WE POSSIBLY

CAN.

BECAUSE WE HAVE SO MANY

PEOPLE WHO CANNOT GET

JOBS.

I'M TALKING ABOUT THOSE

PEOPLE WHO MAYBE JUST

GRADUATED FROM HIGH SCHOOL

OR HAVE AN ASSOCIATE'S

DEGREE AND WON'T FIND IT

IN A BIOTECH PLANT OR A

HIGH-TECH PLANT, BUT MAYBE

WANT TO OPEN UP THEIR OWN

BUSINESS, LIKE I DID 25

YEARS AGO.

>> Rooney: WHAT IS GOING

ON WITH THIS CASINO BILL?

THEY'VE GOT UNTIL THE END

OF TODAY, MIDNIGHT

TONIGHT, OTHERWISE THE

GOVERNOR IS GOING TO HAVE

AN AUTOMATIC VETO POSITION

IN HAND.

THEY CAN DO IT NEXT

WEEK --

>> I DON'T KNOW.

I DON'T KNOW AS MUCH.

I'M SPENDING MORE I'M OFF

BEACON HILL THAN ON BEACON

HILL.

I THINK THEY WILL PASS

SOMETHING, BUT WEATHER IT

PASSES MUSTARD WITH THE

GOVERNOR.

THE GOVERNOR MAY HAVE THE

ULTIMATE AUTHORITY.

IF THEY PASS SOMETHING

WITH SLOTS, AND THE

GOVERNOR SAYS HE DOESN'T

WANT SLOTS, HE COULD VETO

THAT ONE SECTION.

I DON'T LIKE TO USE THE

TERM "ALL BETS ARE OFF"

BUT "ALL BETS ARE OFF."

ANYTHING COULD HAPPEN.

>> Rooney: IF IT SLIDES,

IT WILL GO INTO OTHER

LEGISLATIVE SESSION, AND

FOR ALL INTENTS AND

PURPOSES, IT IS DEAD.

>> AND THERE ARE OTHER

ISSUES OUT THERE.

THE CASINOS ARE REALLY A

SMALL PART OF THE

SOLUTION.

BUT IT TAKES UP A LOT OF

TIME THAT THE LEGISLATURE

TAKES FOR OTHER THINGS

THAT THEY SHOULD OR COULD

BE DOING.

IF I'M GOVERNOR, WE'LL GET

IT DONE.

IF IT DOESN'T GET DONE

THIS YEAR.

PEOPLE SHOULD HAVE THE

OPPORTUNITY TO GAMBLE HERE

IN THE STATE.

WE SHOULD KEEP SOME OF

THAT MONEY THAT IS GOING

OVER THE BORDER TO GAMBLE

IN CONNECTICUT, RHODE

ISLAND AND HERE IN

MASSACHUSETTS.

>> Rooney: ANOTHER ISSUE

ON THE IMMIGRATION LAWS,

YOU'VE BEEN A SUPPORTER OF

TOUGHER IMMIGRATION LAWS

AND CRACKDOWNS.

THERE ARE CERTAIN CITIES

AND TOWNS IN MASSACHUSETTS

THAT SEEM TO HAVE A

GREATER PROBLEM THAN

OTHERS.

LIKE MILLFORD, WHICH IS

KIND OF INTERESTING.

THE GOVERNOR SAYS IT IS

NOT A HUGE PROBLEM IN THIS

STATE.

>> A BIGGER PROBLEM THAN

HE'LL ACKNOWLEDGE.

ESPECIALLY WITH 9.5%

UNEMPLOYMENT.

SO PEOPLE WHO CAN'T GET

JOBS HERE AND SOME ILLEGAL

PEOPLE ARE GETTING JOBS.

>> Rooney: LIKE HOUSE

CLEANING JOBS -- WE ALL

KNOW WHO THESE PEOPLE ARE.

>> AND I THINK THEY ARE

AVAILING THEMSELVES OF

GOVERNMENT SERVICES,

HOUSING THEY SHOULDN'T

HAVE GOTTEN.

IT TURNS PEOPLE AWAY FROM

LEGAL IMMIGRATION.

THAT'S WHAT I WANT TO

AVOID.

LEGAL IMMIGRATION IS A

GOOD THING.

I'VE ALWAYS BEEN

SUPPORTIVE OF IT, AS THE

GREAT GRANDSON OF AN

ILLEGAL IMMIGRANT WHO CAME

HERE LEGALLY.

BUT THEY WANT OUR BORDERS

TO BE CLOSED TO ALL

IMMIGRANTS.

>> Rooney: THAT'S HOW IT

SOUNDS ON THE RADIO.

>> THAT'S WHEN THE

GOVERNMENT DOESN'T DO

THEIR JOBS AS ENFORCING

THE LAWS, AND PEOPLE START

TO TAKE LAWS INTO THEIR

OWN HANDS.

IF YOU'RE NOT REASONABLE

WITH YOUR APPROACH AND LAY

DOWN THE LAW, ANARCHY SETS

IN OR YOU GET THE

EXTREMES.

THAT'S WHAT I DON'T THINK

WE NEED, THE EXTREMES TO

THE RIGHT OR LEFT.

>> Rooney: ALL RIGHT,

INDEPENDENT CANDIDATE FOR

GOVERNOR, TIM CAHILL.

>> THANK YOU.

>> Rooney: WHEN WE

CONTINUE, THE MAN WHO'S

CAREER BECAME EVEN MORE

IMPRESSIVE AFTER HE

RETIRED.