July 23, 2009 : C. David Heyman's book, Bobby and Jackie

>> Emily: WHEN WRITERS SEE DAVID
HEYMANN PEN THE UNAUTHORIZED
BIOGRAPHY OF JACKIE KENNEDY IN
1989, HE SAYS RUMOR HAS SURFACED
THEN SHE AND HER BROTHER-IN-LAW,
ROBERT KENNEDY, HAD AN AFFAIR
FOLLOWING THE ASSASSINATION OF
JOHN F. KENNEDY.
NOW, HEYMANN WRITES HE VERIFIED
THAT AFFAIR AND HIS NEW BOOK IS
BOBBY AND JACKIE A LOVE STORY.
DAVID HEYMANN IS HERE AND
WELCOME.
>> ALL RIGHT, THANKS.
>> HOW DO YOU SEPARATE IT ALL OF
THESE YEARS LATER?
THE RUMOR FROM THE FACT?
>> WELL, WHEN I DID THE BOOK IN
'89, I MEAN, THIS WAS THE FIRST
INDEPENDENT WEND DOE I
GOT -- INNUENDO I GOT OF A
ROMANCE OF A LAUNDERUS THAT
WORKED FOR 20 YEARS FOR KENNEDY.
HE SAID IN 1964 TED KENNEDY WENT
TO VISIT HIS SISTER ETHEL, WENT
OVER TO KISS HER.
ETHEL PUSHED HIM AWAY AND SAID,
WE'LL HAVE NONE OF THAT
BOBBY/JACKIE RELATIONSHIP HERE
IN THIS HOUSEHOLD."
OVER THE YEARS, I WROTE THREE
OTHERCAN KENNEDY BOOKS.
THIS IS THE FOURTH.
I MIGHT ADD, THIS IS THE LAST
BOOK.
I ESTABLISHED RIMS WITH MEMBERS
OF THE INNER SANKS -- I
ESTABLISHED RELATIONSHIPS WITH
MEMBERS OF THE ENTER SANKS.
THESE INTERVIEWS ARE CURRENTLY
AVAILABLE IN THE UNIVERSITY OF
NEW YORK IN STONE OTHERNYBROOK
WHERE I HAVE MY -- STONEYBROOK
WHERE I HAVE MY ARCHIVES.
>> Emily: THIS IS NOT
UNBELIEVABLE.
CERTAINLY IT'S NOT UNBELIEVABLE
WHEN IT COMES TO THE KENNEDY'S
BECAUSE WE HAVE KNOWN FOR
DECADES ABOUT THE LIAISONS OF
JFK AND RFK BUT I THINK PART OF
IT IS THAT PEOPLE DON'T WANT TO
BELIEVE IT ABOUT JACKIE.
>> THAT COULD BE THAT PEOPLE
DON'T WANT TO BELIEVE IT AND
THAT'S ONE OF THE REASONS I
THINK IT'S A BOOK THAT'S
INTERESTING TO HAVE BECAUSE
HOPEFULLY READING IT, YOU'LL
UNDERSTAND THAT THIS WAS A VERY
COMPLICATED, EXPEDIENTLY
IMPORTANT RELATIONSHIP FOR BOBBY
AND JACKIE.
IT BEGAN IN THE WAKE OF THE
ASSASSINATION OF JFK.
FOR BOTH OF THEM, IT WAS A
LIFE-EMBRACING RELATIONSHIP
BECAUSE BOBBY HIMSELF SUFFERED A
NERVOUS BREAKDOWN.
HE STOPPED GOING INTO THE
ATTORNEY GENERAL'S OFFICE.
HE USED TO DRIVE AROUND
AIMLESSLY AND JACKIE WAS JUST AS
BEREFT ARE.
THEY WERE BROUGHT TOGETHER
INITIALLY BY THE SHARED GRIEF.
HE BEGAN TAKING CARE AS A
SURROGATE FATHER FOR THE TWO
KIDS.
HE SPENT MORE TIME WITH JACKIE,
CAROLINE AND JOHN JR. THAN HE
DID WITH HIS BROOD OF 10 AND
ETHEL.
>> WAS IT POSSIBLE THAT HIS
SHARED GRIEF WAS THAT AND THERE
WASN'T A ROMANCE?
>> IT'S POSSIBLE.
UNLESS 75 PEOPLE LIED TO ME AND
PLUS THE FACT I HAD USE OF THE
SECRET SERVICE ARCHIVES, FILES
WHICH WERE NOW MADE AVAILABLE A
YEAR AGO WHICH DOCUMENT BOBBY
KENNEDY'S COMINGS AND GOGDS.
HE WAS IN AND OUT OF JACK -- AND
GOINGS.
HE WAS IN AND OUT OF JACKIE'S
APARTMENT ON A REGULAR BASIS AT
10:45 AT NIGHT.
THERE WERE SIGHTINGS OF THEM
EMBRACING, KISSING AND MORE THAN
THAT OF WHAT WE USED TO CALL IN
PUBLIC GETTING TO THIRD BASE.
THEY TOOK VACATIONS TOGETHER.
IN 1964, THEY WENT TO ANTIGUA IN
THE CARIBBEAN.
IT WAS JACKIE, BOBBY, CHUCK
SPAULDING, GREAT FRIEND OF THE
FAMILY AND LEE.
WHERE WAS ETHEL?
THEY SHARED THE SAME BEDROOM.
NOW THERE WASN'T THE CAMERA IN
THE BEDROOM BUT I MEAN IT
DOESN'T TAKE MUCH
IMAGINATION -- THE HOSTESS WHO
WAS PETER'S MOTHER-IN-LAW, SAID
WHEN ASKED WAS THERE AN AFFAIR
BETWEEN BOBBY AND JACKIE, YES,
INDEED.
>> Emily: WHY IS IT COMING OUT
ALL OF THESE YEARS LATER?
IS IT BECAUSE PEOPLE WEREN'T
DOGGING THE CELEBRITIES AND
CERTAINLY JACKIE WAS ONE RIGHT
AFTER THE DEATH IF NOT BEFORE OF
JFK?
THEY DIDN'T DOG THEM THE WAY
THEY DO NOW?
WHY IS IT COMING OUT NOW?
>> WHY DID IT TAKE THE "NEW YORK
TIMES" 30 YEARS TO DOCUMENT JOHN
F. KENNEDY'S ARDENT WOMANNIZING
IN THE WHITE HOUSE AND NOT JUST
ON MEYER, MONROE, ETC., WE'RE
TALKING ABOUT ANONYMOUS WOMEN
THAT CAME AND WENT ON A DAILY
BASIS IN THOSE DAYS, THE PRESS
AND THE MEDIA WAS SIMPLY NOT
LOOKING INTO THE THE PRIVATES
AND PRIVATE INNER LIVES OF
PUBLIC FIGURES.
>> Emily: OR THEY WERE IN BED
WITH THEM.
>> OR WHO WAS IN BED WITH THEM.
EXACTLY.
>> Emily: SOME OF THE MEDIA?
>> AFTER HART WAS DISCOVERED,
THEN IT BECAME -- 76 I THINK IT
WAS, IT BECAME PRO FORMA.
IF THIS WERE TO TAMS TODAY THEY
WOULD LAST 30 SECONDS AND IT
WOULD BECOME WORLD HEADLINES.
>> Emily: YOU REPORT JACKIE
HERSELF HAD A FEW AFFAIRS.
BOTH WERE TO KIND OF GET BACK AT
JFK?
>> THE HOLDEN ONE WAS.
IT TOOK PLACE WHILE SHE WAS
MARRIED TO JFK.
SHE MADE DAMN WELL SURE HE FOUND
OUT ABOUT IT.
THE FIRST AFFAIR SHE HAD AFTER
PRESIDENT KENNEDY'S DEATH WAS
WITH
[ INDISCERNIBLE ]
I THINK IT HAD NOTHING TO DO
WITH GETTING BACK AT JFK THOUGH
I'M SURE GIVEN THE HISTORY OF
THEIR MARRIAGE THERE WAS GREAT,
FIRST OF ALL, CYNICISM ABOUT
MARRIAGE ON JACKIE'S PART AND A
TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF ANGER
BECAUSE SHE THOUGHT SHE COULD
CHANGE HER HUSBAND AND HE NEVER
CHANGED.
HE WAS SIMPLY A SEDER, THE MALE
COMPONENT OF HIM IN FAUX MANIAC.
-- NYMPHO MANIAC.
BOBBY AND TEDDY WERE MUCH THE
SAME.
BOBBY WAS A LITTLE DIFFERENT
THOUGH.
HE WAS MUCH MORE LOYAL.
HIS RELATIONSHIPS WERE LONGER
LIVED.
IT HAD TO DO WITH THE FACT THAT
THE FAMILY WAS ESTABLISHED LIKE
ROSE AND JOE KENNEDY AND THEY
HAD THEIR CHILDREN, THE HUSBANDS
FELT THEY COULD GO OUT AND DO
WHATEVER THEY WANTED AND THE
WOMEN WERE CONTENT TO HAVE THEIR
CHILDREN AND RAISE THE
FAMILY 'EM YOU'VE COME UNDER
HARSH CRITICISM FOR WRITING THIS
BOOK IN VARIOUS CIRCLES
INCLUDING THE WRITER, LAWRENCE,
WHO DOES A LITTLE BIT OF MUCK
BREAKING HIMSELF.
HE SAID --
>> I WROTE THE BOOK TO MAKE
MONEY.
>> Emily: AND THIS IS GROSSLY
EXAGGERATED AND IT MIGHT BE A
FRIENDSHIP.
>> I GOT MORE CRITICISM HAVING
COME TO BOSTON AS A YANKEE FAN.
THESE ARE RAILINGS.
THESE ARE LIKE GNATS BUZZING
AROUND MY HEAD.
THESE ARE ALWAYS THE AUTHORS
THAT TWO YEARS LATER SUBSCRIBE
WHO WHAT I'VE WRITTEN TWO YEARS
PRIOR AND PUT IT DOWN IN THEIR
OWN BOOK.
THERE YOU HAVE IT.
WHAT CAN YOU DO?
AUTHORS ARE AS JEALOUS A LOT.
>> Emily: IN TERMS OF THE FAMILY
ITSELF, THOUGH, HAS ANY OF THE
REMAINING SURVIVING ENTER SANKT
OF THAT FAMILY COOPERATED WITH
YOU IN ANY WAY?
>> IN THE PAST, I KNEW BOBBY
KENNEDY JR..
HE SAID TO ME -- AND THIS IS
SORT OF A COMMENT IN GROWING UP
IN THAT FAMILY AFTER HIS
FATHER DEATH.
HE SAID, I ALWAYS WANTED TO GO
TO SLEEP AT AGE 18 AND WAKE UP
20 YEARS LATER, THE SIGNIFICANCE
OF WHICH WAS THAT IT WAS SO
CRAZY IN THAT HOUSEHOLD, I MEAN,
IT WAS SO DYSFUNCTIONAL AND HE,
HIMSELF HAD BEEN ADDICTED TO
HEROIN.
HE WAS FOUND UNCONSCIOUS IN A
MEN'S ROOM IN THE MIDWEST IN AN
AIRPORT.
THEN WE KNOW ABOUT THE DAVID
KENNEDY, THE OVERDOSE DEATH.
WE KNOW ABOUT MICHAEL KENNEDY'S
SCHEME TO -- SKIING INTO A TREE
ON HIS WAY DOWN A SKI SLOPE
WHILE PLAYING TOUCH FOOTBALL.
THAT FAMILY, I DON'T REMEMBER
WHO IT WAS EXACTLY BUT SOMEONE,
I THINK IT WAS JACKIE WHO SAID
YOU KNOW, SHE DIDN'T WANT HER
KIDS TO BE BROUGHT UP WITH
BOBBY'S BROOD.
SHE SAID ETHEL IS THE WORLD'S
WORST MOTHER.
>> Emily: ALL RIGHT.
>> THAT'S MEAN SPIRITED BUT
THAT'S WHAT SHE SAID, NOT ME.
>> DAVID HEYMANN, GOOD TO HAVE
YOU HERE.
>> ALL RIGHT, THANK YOU VERY
MUCH.
>> Emily: WHEN WE CURN, CENTER
STAGE WITH -- WHEN WE CONTINUE,
CENTER STAGE WITH
TARE -- JAREDBONE -- JARED B
BOWEN.
MOST BUT NOT ALL THEATERS HAVE
GONE DARK FOR THE SUMMER IN
TONIGHT'S SPECIAL SUMMER CENTER
STAGE, JARED BOWEN LOOKS AT THE
TWO STAGES.
>> YOU GET WORKS OF WILLIAM
SHAKESPEARE ABRIDGED.
[ RAPPING ]
RELATIVE NEWCOMERS, THE ORFEO
GROUP RUN THROUGHOUT HITS AT
BREAKNECK SPEED.
THEY TURNED ROMEO AND JULIETTE
INTO SUBLIME IF NOT PRETTY
COMEDY.
[ SCREAMING ]
THE COMPLETE WORKS OF WILLIAM
SHAKESPEARE ABRIDGED HAS BEEN
EXTENDED IT CLAIMS ON CHRISTIAN
HERDER PARK THROUGH AUGUST 22ND.
THERE ARE FABLES OF A MUCH
MORE SUBDUED SORT SOMETIMES.
IN COMPANY ONE'S "AFTER THE
QUAKE."
>> [ INDISCERNIBLE ]
>> BASED WORKS BY NOVELIST
MIRAKOMI, AFTER THE QUAKE IS
INSPIRED BY A DEVASTATING 1995
EARTHQUAKE IN JAPAN.
HARDLY TRAGIC THIS PLAY
ALTERNATES BETWEEN UNFITLED
ROMANCE AND THE HEART OF STORY
TELLING WITH AN IMAGINE SUPER
FROG.
>> THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I PROPOSE
TO DO.
YOU AND I WILL GO UNDERGROUND
BENEATH THE TOKYO SECURITY BANKS
TO DO MORTAL COMBAT WITH WORMS.
>> COMPANY ONE'S "AFTER THE
QUAKE" PLAYS IN THE BOSTON
CENTER FOR THE ARTS THROUGH
AUGUST 15TH.
AT THE COLONIAL THEATER, THE
SHOW THAT REDEFINED MUSICAL
THEATER 13 YEARS AGO, "RENT."
[ SINGING ]
A VIGROUS AND VIBRANT PRODUCTION
"RENT" FEATURES TWO OF THE
SHOW'S ORIGINAL CAST MEMBERS,
ADAM MASS QUEL -- PASS QUEL A
AND -- THEY'RE TRYING TO FIND
BOHEMIA ALONG WITH THEIR
IMPOVERISHED SOULS IN NEW YORK'S
LOWER EAST SIDE.
[ SINGING ]
IF YOU'VE NEVER SEEN THE SHOW
AND EVEN IF YOU HAVE, DO NOT
MISS THE CHANCE TO SEE THIS
PRODUCTION PLAYING AT THE
COLONIAL THEATER THROUGH SUNDAY,
JULY 26TH.
ALSO BACK AFTER SELL OUT THIS
PAST WINTER, THE ENCHANTING OUR
YELL -- AURELOIO'S ORATO.
THEY RETURN TO THE THREAT WET
VISUALLY SUMPTUOUS ODE OF THE 6
OF OLD.
IT PLAYED AT THE ART'S DRAMA
CENTER THROUGH AUGUST 2ND.
>> Emily: JARED BOWEN IS HERE
ALONG WITH CRITIC TERRY BYRNE.
WELCOME TO BOTH OF YOU.
>> YOU WOULD STAY IN THE
SHAKESPEARE PLAYS.
IT'S ENGAGING.
THE AUDIENCE IS PART OF THE FUN
GOING ON.
>> THIS IS RELATIVELY NEW
THEATER GROUP.
THEY JUST WANT TO DO THEATER
FOR THEATER'S SAKE AND BRING IN
NEW AUDIENCES.
THEY HAVE INEXPENSIVE TICKETS.
THEY'RE DOING THIS IN THAT PARK
WHICH IS FANTASTIC AND THEY
HAVE -- THESE THREE ACTORS HAVE
SUCH TREMENDOUS ENERGY IN THE
WAY THEY SHIFT THE CHARACTERS.
THEY HAVE SO MUCH FUN WITH IT.
IT'S VERY, VERY INFECTIOUS.
>> Emily: THREE STOOGEY?
>> A LITTLE.
>> Emily: BUT IT WORKS?
>> IT'S NOT A PROBLEM.
>> THEY'RE RUNNING THROUGH 37
SHAKESPEARE PLAYS.
IT'S WORTH SEEING.
>> IT'S A LOT OF FUN.
>> Emily: "AFTER THE QUAKE"
THAT'S BEEN TALKED ABOUT AND
REVIEWED AND GOT SOME -- SOUNDS
INTERESTING.
>> I REALLY LIKED IT.
I THOUGHT THAT THE NOVELS ARE A
MIX OF THE MUNDANE AND THE
FANTASTICAL AND FRANK, THE
ADAPTOR, TAKES TWO VERY
DIFFERENT SHORT STORIES AND PUTS
THEM TOGETHER FOR THIS AND I
THINK THERE'S A LITTLE TOO MUCH
OF THE NARRATOR IN IT.
THAT'S A PROBLEM, BECAUSE YOU
HAVE TO BACK AWAY AND MAKE IT A
DRAMATIC EVENT BUT I FOUND IT
KIND OF HYPNOTIC.
>> I ACTUALLY HAVE TO SAY FOR A
LOT OF THIS, I GUESS I
OVERTHOUGHT IT BECAUSE THE
BEGINNING, IN THE FIRST HALF
PROBABLY DIDN'T WORK FOR ME.
AS MUCH AS I THOUGHT THE
PERFORMERS WERE TERRIFIC, THE
SET WAS TERRIFIC, THE
STAFF -- THE BASE CLARINET AND
THE MUSICIANS WERE GREAT.
THEY ADDED A LOT TO IT.
I THINK IT WAS TOO MUCH STORY
FOR ME IN THE BEGINNING.
IT'S TOO COMPLICATED, I THOUGHT.
I THOUGHT IT MORE ENGAGING
TOWARD THE END.
IT TOOK ME A LONG TIME TO SETTLE
INTO IT.
>> Emily: ALL RIGHT, "RENT"
THAT'S COME BACK.
YOU ACTUALLY -- I THINK YOU
SURPRISED YOURSELF, JARED.
YOU SAID YOU LIKED IT.
>> DID I SURPRISE MYSELF BECAUSE
THESE ACTORS, THE TWO THAT ARE
COMING BACK FROM THE ORIGINAL
CAST ARE 37 AND 38 NOW.
I THOUGHT THIS IS PROBABLY A
GIMMICK.
I COULDN'T BELIEVE HOW MUCH I
ENJOYED THIS FIRST OF ALL, THEIR
VOICES.
ADAM'S VOICE IN PARTICULAR IS
AMAZING.
>> PHENOMENAL, YEAH.
>> IT'S SUCH A TIGHT, VIBRANT,
WELL CHOREOGRAPHED, ENERGETIC
SHOW FANTASTIC.
>> THEY RAISED THE LEVEL OF
PERFORMANCE FOR EVERY CAST
MEMBER IN THE SHOW THAT WANTED
TO PROVE THEMSELVES TO THESE TWO
GUYS.
ER THAT AMAZING.
I'VE SEEN IT FOUR TIMES NOW.
>> Emily: HAS IT EVER REALLY
GONE OUT OF CIRCULATION?
>> NOT REALLY.
IT WAS IN THE WAYNE CENTER ONE
YEAR.
THAT WAS TOO BARN-LIKE.
HERE IT FITS IN THE COLONIAL.
AND THE AUDIENCE, IT'S LIKE A
ROCK CONCERT BECAUSE THE
AUDIENCE KNOWS WHAT'S COMING
THEY START CHEERING AS SOON AS
THEY HEAR THE FIRST THREE BARS
OF THE MUSIC.
>> IT'S SELLING INCREDIBLY WELL.
IT'S AMAZING.
I CAN REMEMBER WHEN "RENT" CAME
OUT.
THAT'S WHY THE STUDENT RUSH
TICKETS STARTED AND SO FORTH.
PEOPLE HAD AFFECTION FOR IT.
NOW IT'S YOUNG PEOPLE THAT
WEREN'T PROBABLY ALIVE WHEN IT
CAME OUT IS GOING TO IT.
IT'S GOT THE GREAT CULTURAL
RESIDENCE.
>> Emily: THE LAST ONE, AURELIO?
>> I THOUGHT IT WAS A DELIGHT.
IT'S CHARLIE CHAPLIN'S
GRANDDAUGHTER.
IT'S UNEXPECTED, FRILLY, SILLY
CIRCUS.
IT'S A NICE THING TO SEE.
>> SPEAKING OF THE HYPNOTIC
STATE YOU FOUND YOURSELF IN
"AFTER THE QUAKE" THAT'S WHAT I
FOUND FROM SEEING AURELIO THIS
SUMMER.
IT'S WONDERFUL TO SEE THIS
HAPPENING.
SHE DOES SO MUCH WITH SCENERY
AND PROPS.
SHE'S BEAUTIFUL HERSELF.
IT'S A GREAT HOUR AND A HALF TO
SIT IN THE THEATER.
THERE'S EVERY REASON TO GO BACK
AND SEE IF IT IF YOU MISSED IT.
IT'S TERRIFIC.
>> Emily: PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BE
DISAPPOINTED BECAUSE OF WHAT
HAPPENED WITH THE NORTH SHORE
MUSIC CENTER.
YOU HAVE INFORMATION FOR PEOPLE.
>> THERE ARE 4,500 HOUSEHOLDS,
10,000 PEOPLE WHO PAID FOR
SUBSCRIPTIONS TO THE THEATER
EVEN THOUGH THE THEATER KNEW IT
WAS GOING UNDER.
ARTS BOSTON COLLABORATED WITH 12
LOCAL THEATERS THAT PEOPLE WHO
HAVE PAID FOR THE SEASON
SUBSCRIPTIONS COULD GO TO THE
ARTS BOSTON WEB SITE AND FIND
OUT HOW THEY CAN GET FREE
TICKETS TO ALL OF THESE OTHER
THEATERS BECAUSE THEY'VE ALREADY
PAID FOR NORTH SHORE SO THEIR
STUDENT PASSES WON'T GO TO WASTE
BECAUSE THEY PROBABLY WON'T GET
THEIR MONEY BACK.
>> ARTSSES BOSTON WEB SITE.
WHAT'S THAT?
>> ARTSSES BOSTON.ORG
BACK -- ARTS BOSTON.ORG/SEASON
OPENER.
>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
THAT'S IT FOR GREATER BOSTON.
TOMORROW ON "BEAT THE PRESS"
MORE ON THE COVERAGE OF THE SKIP
GATES ARREST PLUS ESPN LASHES
OUT AFTER SOME NEWS OUTLETS
PUBLISH NUDE PHOTOS OF ONE OF
THEIR REPORTERS AND REMEMBERING
WALTER CRONKITE.
THAT'S TOMORROW AT 7:00.
I'M EMILY ROONEY.
GOOD NIGHT.
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